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Weird stutter since I upgraded
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Posted by: Mathias
I recently upgraded the old thing a bit. I installed an EVGA 7600GT to replace my GeForce 6800. And let me tell you, changing parts in a Dell Dimension machine is not easy with all their plastic crap in the way.
Anyways, the main problem I'm having is that ever since I made this upgrade (as well as removing my useless Firewire and Dial-Up Modem cards and cleaning out the insides with canned air), my games do a weird sort of trick.
So far I've only tried FEAR and Supreme Commander. In FEAR, the test demo they do with the game in the options runs far better than it used to and on higher settings. However, in actual gameplay, there's a lot of stuttering, especially during scenes with lots of new elements (i.e. bullets, fires, enemies, etc.) Fast paced action is, thus, ruined.
As for Supreme Commander, a somewhat similar thing happens. I haven't gotten into any fights yet, but when I skirmish and start making the base, things are mostly smooth until the builders start building. The system will freeze for like 1/2 a second, then build the building (which goes very smoothly) and once it's finished and goes onto the next thing, freezes for 1/2 a second again and then builds smoothly.
I've come to the conclusion that this is due to 1 of 3 things. 1 - Sub-par drivers. 2 - Low memory. 3 - CPU isn't enough. I highly doubt the Graphics Card is at fault because when it runs without interruption, it runs very smoothly and nicely. I could turn up the graphics a lot and have my man in FEAR or my units in Supreme Commander run around for a while and it'll run very nicely, but once something new comes along, then I start getting problems.
One thing I notice is that when I alt-tab out and go to my task manager (while it's been open in the background), my page file is being used a LOT. I set it at a 2GB min, 4GB max and the task manager shows about 1.1 to 1.3 GB being used. Also my processor seems to sometimes go to almost 100% use (but this could be due to the heavy use of the page file). Since HT is active, I see two CPU screens and I think only the left one was nearing 100%. The other was mostly normal.
Here's my setup
OS - Windows XP Home 2
CPU - Intel P4 3.4GHz w/ HT
GPU - EVGA GeForce 7600GT
PSU - 350W
HDD - 160GB
RAM - 1 GB, DDR-533
Model - Dell Dimension 8400
The best thing I can think of to do for now is order 1 GB more of RAM in two sticks of 512 MB at DDR 533 (to match the rest of it) and install some of Tweaks R Us's XG drivers.
Anyone else have some suggestions?
Posted by: P0nix
think you nailed it with sub-par drivers, get the new nvidia drivers off of their site. Also, when upgrading from a 6800 to a 7600, personally, I had to do a fresh install to keep the system from crashing. You can try an nvidia driver cleaner program and then install the newest drivers - best bet. Otherwise, backup and format d00d.
Posted by: Mathias
Ok. I'm getting 162.18 right now, but I'm gonna get me some XG drivers from Tweaks R Us once someone from the site tells me what'd be best for the 7600GT.
Posted by: FadedMaster
The one thing that jumps out at me is your 350w power supply. Stuttering is almost guaranteed to be the PSU in this case. What're some detailed specs on the PSU? (Check the sticker on the side of the PSU).
And yeah, Dell's suck. :-P
Posted by: Mathias
Yeah, I thought the 350W PSU might be the problem, but I was kind've hoping it wasn't. Changing things around in a Dell machine is bad enough as is, but changing the PSU is one thing I really don't want to do since the PSU seems to be made specifically for Dell, thus only fitting on that case. Also because of how the back of the case is made, the PSU is arranged with the plug on the left and fan on the right, which is opposite how most PSU's seem to be oriented when I look at NewEgg.
By the way, as per specs of the PSU, it's a bit hard to figure those out becuase getting the PSU out of the case is a bitch and even when I can see the sticker from underneath with a flashlight, it's very hard to make out what's on the sticker. I was lucky to figure out it's 350W, let alone figure out its power needs. But I'll try again later and see what comes up.
Also another reason I thought the 350W PSU might work is because when I used the Extreme Power Calculator with all my parts from before I upgrade compared to all my parts now (7600GT and less two PCI cards), I actually came up with a lower power requirement than before. Also I read from some sites that the 7600GT needs a 350W minimum PSU, but the box itself says minimum of 400W. Guess I should've went with the higher number.
Posted by: FadedMaster
It's always better to err on the higher side when it comes to that stuff. Last I knew of, the Dell cases just positioned the PSUs weird (exactly how you explained actually) with the sticker facing down instead of out. It's possible that it's something else other than the PSU, but I'm fairly confident that's what the issue is. Otherwise you could always get a new tower too.  haha.
Posted by: P0nix
I've done countless PSU installations on dells. It's very simple, there's nothing specific to dell that should make it harder, unscrew the B*tch and slide in the new one, no worries mate.
Posted by: Mathias
Well, not sure how, but I think the problem fixed itself. Installing the latest official Nvidia drivers helped fix FEAR and at first Supreme Commander was still jittering, but now everything seems to go fine. Supreme Commander still does, from time to time, freeze a sec before building things, but now it's so minor it's barely noticable. Also every other game I've run so far is doing great, much better than my old GeForce 6800. By the way, I've been playing Rise of Nations - Rise of Legends, FEAR, Supreme Commander, Command & Conquer 3 and probably soon I'll be playing Warcraft III.
Oh and while putting a new PSU into a Dell I guess does seem easy, it's just the way the back of the case is. There's just a small little hole for the plug to stick out and I think some PSUs have their plugs oriented so that it wouldn't fit in there. But whatever, not like it really matters now.
Also I think another gig of RAM will make this baby run even smoother.
Posted by: FadedMaster
You should definitely find out the speed on the RAM. Especially if you want an effective upgrade for it. Although 2GB isn't too bad for most things you're doing now. I'd probably put it off and wait a while and invest in better hardware all around (although your current set up is pretty decent). I have friends still effectively gaming on half of what you have.
Posted by: goranpaa
You should have a sticker on the RAM sticks telling you the specs.
Posted by: goranpaa
 Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mathias
Ok. I'm getting 162.18 right now, but I'm gonna get me some XG drivers from Tweaks R Us once someone from the site tells me what'd be best for the 7600GT.
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Personally, I did'nt like the orginal or the XG version of 162.18. Too slow, and less good image quality.The best XG drivers is 94.20 (In TweakRUS, XG archives.) 160.02, 162.01 and the best so far 94.24 wich is the latest XP, XG driver.
(It's recommended to both uninstall the driver, and using Driver Cleaner Professional, after using a XG driver and starting to use an orginal Nvidia driver again, or updating the XG drivers.)
http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745
But unfortunatly, the TweakRUS download site have been hacked. so you can't get to it for the moment.
But the guys at TweakRUS are working on fixing it.
Posted by: Mathias
All I know about the RAM from my BIOS settings and what little Windows tells me is this.
1024 MB or 1 GB
DDR2 533 (PC4200)
Latency unknown
Posted by: goranpaa
Download CPU Z. It should be able to tell you the timings:
http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php
Posted by: Mathias
Ok, here's what CPU-Z has to say about my CPU and Memory.
CPU - Intel Pentium 4 550, Prescott, Socket 775 LGA, 90 nm, 3.152 volts, 17.0x multiplier, D0 stepping, 16 KB L1 Cache, 1024 KB L2 Cache, 1 core, 2 threads
FSB is 199.5 MHz, rated at 798.0 MHz
Memory - Samsung, DDR2, 1024 MB, 266 MHz/PC2-4300, 4-4-4-11 timings
FSB:RAM ratio is 3:4
So, given this information and the fact that I have 2 empty memory slots, DDR2-533/PC4200 or PC4300 RAM should be the best thing, right? Or is there more to it than that?
Posted by: goranpaa
The timings should match and be as low as possible. Lower timings = faster. But those Samsungs is about as low as it gets for PC 533.
If you pair faster RAM up with those you alreay have. Let's say like a couple of RAM sticks of DDR2 667 (PC2 5300) for ex. The faster RAM will still run at the Samsungs speed.
This is a great kit:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16820231018
Posted by: Mathias
Actually, my idea was to just get two sticks of 512 MB (at 4-4-4-12 or 4-4-4-11 if possible) and put them in the two empty slots for a total of 2 GB with the other pair, cause I can do that for only $40.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16820161669
or
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16820231041
And if I'm going to spend $100 bucks on RAM, it's not going to be on DDR2 533 kits. I'd rather use that money for DDR2 800 or 1066. Only reason I'm not is cause my current board probably can't handle it.
Posted by: goranpaa
In that case if I where you. I would get the G.skills over the Wintec Ampos.
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