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female gaming
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Posted by: redwench
following is a short (1 page) article/interview on pcgaming and women.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sc...000/1708233.stm
Posted by: Tecil
My wife plays games with my friends and I all the time. She likes Diablo II and I had her hooked on Tribes for a while.
Posted by: JANNA
lacarte is a loon. she misses the point of those pink fluff games altogether and just cuz she is a women doesnt mean she is good at game making ssx tricky sux heh. a game that is good will gather an audience regardless of gender. take EQ or UO or bnet. the things that make a lot of women not play is the perception that games are for kids. women buy the majority of games they may not play em as much but they buy em for family kids boyfriend or husband. even my mom likes to play games on a console or computer and she is less than computer literate. a game that sux wont make it regardless of how oriented it is to men or women take jurassic park offering for the pc from a few years ago as a sample. throwing gender bias into a game male or female wont make a game succeed based purely on that. the other day i was in the mall gamestore picking up halo and this mom with 3 small kids in tow was buying a copy of MGS2 and talking to her husband saying she couldnt wait to get home and try it out... perhaps miss lacarte shouldnt let her gender bias blind her to the real world. women dont want games geared to women, men dont want games geared to men they both just want good fun games.
Posted by: redwench
im thinking you didnt read the article janna. lacarte said basically what you did, that good quality games will attract both genders.
Posted by: JANNA
i did read it and she came across to me as the feminist type who thinks only women can make stuff that appeals to women. truly tho gender is irrelevent and matters only to those that wish to put down one half of the population of the world in favour of another. where i work 80-85% of the folk that are employeed here are women from the lowest position all the way to administrator. and it does surprise a lot of folk that this place is also one of the top private brain injury rehab facilities in the country and its primarily run by women. i find it interesting that the most qualified people are women. but i do get offended by public speaking folk when they come across like that person did in the article.
Posted by: redwench
lets see, shes offended by the pink and purple games. she was quotes as saying that men and women are attracted to many of the same things in games. (in a big sidebar, incase you missed it) the only thing she expresses a real distaste for are games that are targeted toward men. which annoys the hell out of me too. games that advertise with t&a are invariably bad.
Posted by: Ion Silverbolt
*Hides copy of Heavy Metal F.A.K.K.2. *
Posted by: Null Actor
That article is retarded. The article contradicts, and defeats, itself.
Posted by: laborat
It may or may not be relevant or even necessary to comment on the debate between Red and Janna, so I won't. I do however have my own experiences with Woman Gamer's.
My first experience with them was, with of all people, my mother who insisted on going down a steep hill in a soap box derby racer before she would give her okay for me to build one and compete. I think that many Moms at least try to understand the games their kids are playing and many go on to become gamers themselves. I knew of several family units that played together on battlenet.
It is true that the major complaint of Women gamers is that they are considered women first, gamers second. By male gamers!!! Any Male under 15 has issues with them. Any Male over 15 has issues with them. Women gamers seem to be either Healers or Ass Kicking Warriors...They are cunning and blood thirsty. Anyone who thinks they are not as good as male gamers is an idiot.
Posted by: Forty-Three
Either I'm completely blind, or I'm not really seeing this massive imbalance in the gaming market. From what I've seen, the gaming market generally caters towards specific tastes. If you want "interesting games, rich characters and storylines, immersive experiences, giant landscapes", there shouldn't really be that much of a shortage of this.
Oh, and I'd like to see these studies that pinpoint exactly what men and women want in games. Again, I've been getting the impression that there is a wide spectrum of different people with different tastes.
Sorry, but I can't see a whole lot of substance in this article. Like people have said before, it's self contradictory, far too generalized, and relies far too much on one person's perception. Simply calling the battle cry of "Inequality!" isn't going to prove your point.
Posted by: redwench
correct, it is a piece of fluff. but every major game and gaming site (including this one) assumes that all the customers are male. i just thought id post that to remind you people that there is another gender out there.
Posted by: Null Actor
Not really true redwench. As a game developer I can tell you that I've never even considered (or cared for that matter) wether it was a guy or girl who would end up playing my game. Few people I know do either.
Posted by: redwench
oh yes, that lovely game, what was it now, panty raid i believe. obviously, the designers didnt have a gender in mind for that. or the deer hunting games.
obviously, i cant speak to your mind, but its obvious from the game design and marketing of many (no, not all) games that they are targeted toward men. the major characters are men, the women but not the men wear the skimpiest clothes imaginable. you get the point. blizzard and black isle are better than most in that regard.
Posted by: TotalRecall
Umm...you buy the game if you like it. Complaining doesn't change marketing hype.
Posted by: Sarc
This is like saying, exotic dance clubs are degrading to women. If we didn't HAVE women, we wouldn't have exotic dance clubs.
It's not our fault (men) that women decide to stay in the kitchen and go shopping.
Posted by: redwench
ok, that just offensive. makes my point quite nicely too.
Posted by: Kdr Kane
 Quote:
Originally posted by Sarc
This is like saying, exotic dance clubs are degrading to women. If we didn't HAVE women, we wouldn't have exotic dance clubs.
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You haven't seen much of the world, have you? 
Posted by: Foogar
I personally don't like the pink-fluffy games eaither. Is it because I'm male? Don't think so, they just annoy me as I'm sure they do some women too.
I personally enjoy playing FPS games against other people. Other people includes both male and female opponents in case you were wondering. As a matter of fact, the one person that has beaten me the worst at Quake 3 happened to be female. I'm not ashamed of that in the least because I had a lot of fun that match.
Screw gender rules, I play games I have fun with.
Posted by: SKYHN
My girlfriend enjoys games from time to time. She loves the final fantasy games. Were gonna have a hard time deciding who gets to play it when I get it on Wed(we live together). She doesnt care for PC games much, but she actually liked RTCW for some reason, the sims is her favorite PC game I think. I caught her playing the sims at work the other day on my laptop when I went to take her to lunch.
Posted by: Null Actor
Quote:
Originally posted by redwench
oh yes, that lovely game, what was it now, panty raid i believe. obviously, the designers didnt have a gender in mind for that. or the deer hunting games.
obviously, i cant speak to your mind, but its obvious from the game design and marketing of many (no, not all) games that they are targeted toward men. the major characters are men, the women but not the men wear the skimpiest clothes imaginable. you get the point. blizzard and black isle are better than most in that regard.
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Panty Raider was a pathetic game made by a pathetic group of people for no other reason than it's shock value. Don't use that as an example, because it is totally non-typical.
As for girls in skimpy clothing... well, I attribute that to the fact that most of the artists in the games industry are men, and they aren't particularly fond of drawing/modeling/texturing scantiliy clad men. hehe.
Posted by: SKYHN
Speaking of Panty Raider, just look how many hentai games are out there. Japan has like all the Adult rated games. Not that I have any of them...cough...
Posted by: redwench
nothing wrong with adult games. as long as both genders are, shall we say, in similar states of dress/undress.
Posted by: Canis Lupus
Quote:
Originally posted by redwench
nothing wrong with adult games. as long as both genders are, shall we say, in similar states of dress/undress.
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But too many undressed men will turn off the majority (male "gaming" crowd) ... bad for business 
Oh, and that's based on statistics, not female intuition
Posted by: Sarc
Quote:
Originally posted by Kdr Kane
You haven't seen much of the world, have you?
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Well, if living in Oregon for 90% of my life classifies as not seeing much of the world, then no I havn't.
Also, if you're trying to say that there are male strip clubs, yes I know. But, I'll bet that they are out numbered by female dance clubs, by at-least 7-to-1.
My basis, There are no male clubs that I know of in Oregon, and only one club that had female dancers had a male dance night, one night a week or month, can't remember which.
My question basically is: If women get so bent out of shape about the sexual inuendos that are used or supported by the populous in movies, strip clubs, publications, and games, then why is it that many women (out of those I've met) use there sexuality to get a guys attention, then turn around and call us sexist pigs for expecting more of it after they've "got us"? ? ... ... er' somthing like that.
Posted by: redwench
who said anything about innuendos? i was objecting to a double standard.
Posted by: Sarc
Ok...
Computers, let alone computer games are fairly new to the world.
Consider how long people have been around, people have been having sex and over coming segrigation by sex for quite some time.
Time is all that's needed to eventually even the playing feild (no pun intended) for computer gaming.
Done.
Posted by: Kdr Kane
If we didn't have women, men would dress up and dance for us. Silly boy.
Posted by: Sarc
Quote:
Originally posted by Kdr Kane
If we didn't have women, men would dress up and dance for us. Silly boy.
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Please tell me you don't have gay tendAncies.
Posted by: Kdr Kane
I don't.
Posted by: redwench
and what would be wrong if he did? well?
Posted by: Ion Silverbolt
Quote:
Originally posted by redwench
and what would be wrong if he did? well?
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Well we don't need to hear about it either way. Too personal.
No gay cracks Sarc. I know you didn't mean anything bad, but some might be offended if you started badmouthing certain social groups.
Posted by: Sarc
Quote:
Originally posted by redwench
and what would be wrong if he did? well?
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Hay, his choice.
Just don't expect me to watch.
Posted by: Kdr Kane
I apologize if I got this thread off track in any way.
Posted by: Sarc
Quote:
Originally posted by Kdr Kane
I apologize if I got this thread off track in any way.
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Me too.
Posted by: Bishop
This thread was doomed from the beginning.
should be dragged out and shot, but then again so should 75% of the world.
Posted by: WindowLiquor
...I'd like to apologize for all the petulant knee-jerk gainsaying of any and all feminist messages. Hey, some people find feminism threatening. Go figure.
"Well, the first thing we did right,
Was the day we started to fight,
Keep your eyes on the Prize; hold on, hold on."
P.S. Where are the contradictions in the article? I'm not saying there aren't any, just that I sure couldn't find any.
P.P.S. When game designers use skin to sell games, they make me wonder whom they're trying to reach. Anybody old enough to like girls is going to want more than they can show. So they wind up making half-baked titles that really sell on their mainstream "sex" appeal rather than on any real merits... yes, you get Tomb Raider and Fakk2. Personally I like to keep my porn and my games in different places...
Posted by: Null Actor
Hey hey hey... don't bash the resident game developer! (That's me)
Anyway, it's only ever BAD games that do that kind of crap, so I don't see the big deal. No one plays bad games, the end. What's the problem?
PS... Are you an aphex twin fan by chance?
Posted by: SKYHN
Has anyone played Pun Pun Gobae 1 or 2 for PSOne/PS2?
Posted by: WindowLiquor
Oh, make no mistake, I download nude skins for all my 3D shooters, and I'm trying to get my friend to download all the trashy adult Sims. I'm not against the concept of sexy video game content, just typically its execution, and the fact that it seems often a cover for substandard quality. But don't take it all personal-like, if you're developing games you're already living the dream, I feel like we're friends already, let me beta-test.
While we're off topic, Drukqz doesn't seem as inspired as Richard D. James Album, but maybe it'll grow on me. I've heard the rumor that it's not even a real album, that it's just random crap off his hard drive... but you can't believe most of what you read on the Internet.
"Fantasia, having a party is _not_ my idea of a fantasy."
Posted by: Null Actor
I like druqks quite a bit. Great album overall, with some weird shit.
But really... random stuff off his harddrive sounds like typical aphex twin to me... lol.
You ever seen the full music video for windowlicker? 
BTW... dare you to go to www.drukqs.com.
Posted by: WindowLiquor
Hehe, yeah, I think I caught the Drukqz link off Memepool or something. The Windowlicker video was pure genius... or something. Especially that intro wit da homeez. Keepinih real, onna strenf tip...
I've never been so scared of jiggly video hos.
Posted by: Null Actor
ROFL
yeah. no doubt. seen the video for come to daddy?
Posted by: WindowLiquor
Yeah, I've seen Come To Daddy (Pappy Mix), but ... I was a little put off. I didn't think it was scary like the song, more goofy like the Haunted Manor at Great Adventure. Color me jaded. Have you seen the Donkey Rhubarb video? Now *that's* disturbed.
Posted by: AK47
anyone ever see the Simpsons episode where they go to the comic book convention and the fat comicbook store owner is talking with the woman (with huge braces on her teeth) about some comic series.....
deja vu
Posted by: SKYHN
"How would you like to go out on a date with me sometime?"
"Comb the sweet tarts out of your beard and you gotta a deal!"
"Dont try to change me baby.."
Posted by: AK47
thats the one
lol
Posted by: Spider
lol.
Posted by: EOT(US)
*snicker* you people are funny! hehe
Posted by: one
Remember that sex sells.
Posted by: Indira
I came into this thread a little late but here is my two cents.
The thing about the scantily clad women characters in games is: even though I am a female, I'm not interested in a game full of scantily clad men. As a matter of a fact, that would turn me away from a game. I can live with another Laura Croft, even if it is stupid to give her such huge boobs. I still liked playing the game, it's just that sometimes her boobs were all you could see...
My sister likes those 'pink games'. She loaded some game where you shop in a mall onto our computer. It was pretty empty. I mean, how much fun can you really have with a game about makeup or clothes? Other games have more content and that is what makes them fun for me, it's not over in an hour. I don't think people really need to try to target women, just make their games better.
I love the color pink... in real life. I like decorating and putting on makeup. But when I am playing a game, I want to KILL KILL KILL!
Posted by: Spider
Yeah I mean come on, breasts that large on such a lithe frame is just begging for all sorts of back problems.
Posted by: Indira
Haha.
Speaking of Tomb Raider, has anyone seen the TV series called "Relic Hunter"? What a rip off!
Posted by: Null Actor
Quote:
Originally posted by one
Remember that sex sells.
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Sex doesn't sell nearly as well as a QUALITY title.
This is true for all forms of media, be it games, movies, or books.
Posted by: redwench
yeah, ive seen it. the acting is actually better than anything else. the writing and plot suck big time. couldnt stand to watch it, and i like tia carrera.
Posted by: WindowLiquor
Quote:
Originally posted by AK47
anyone ever see the Simpsons episode where they go to the comic book convention and the fat comicbook store owner is talking with the woman (with huge braces on her teeth) about some comic series.....
deja vu
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Whoa, if I didn't know better I'd say you think I'm either a woman or gay. What's the deal?
Wait, it's the portrait, isn't it?
Posted by: ZeRo_MaXwInG
I think this article is pointless. Female gamers should be considered to b the same type of gamers as male gamers. it's a matter of taste and nothing else. It's just that a majority of females who do play games dont have the same interests and attention grabbers as males do.
Posted by: redwench
oh yes. i play barbie games on my comp. wouldnt dream of playing baldurs gate, d2, starcraft or any other "manly" game.
Posted by: Indira
I think you should be able to decorate the bases in Starcraft. You know, a throw pillow here, some fringe there. And there shouldn't be any killing. Blood stains are hard to get out of white pillows. It would be extra fun if you could do the makeup for the main characters before each level! I'm thinking lots of gold eyeshadow for Ranor, and lots of blush. I have a pair of earings that would look fabu on him!
Ok that was random...
Posted by: Null Actor
Quote:
Originally posted by ZeRo_MaXwInG
I think this article is pointless. Female gamers should be considered to b the same type of gamers as male gamers. it's a matter of taste and nothing else. It's just that a majority of females who do play games dont have the same interests and attention grabbers as males do.
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Not true. In fact, I have yet to meet a girl gamer who's tastes differ more than slightly from your average guy gamer.
Oh, and windowliquor... I can actually believe that Drukqs is not a real album, especially after listening to richard d james and I care because you do, because drukqs could be leftover cuts from those two albums. And a bunch of crap thrown in (like answering machine messages LOL)
Posted by: AK47
Quote:
Originally posted by WindowLiquor
Whoa, if I didn't know better I'd say you think I'm either a woman or gay. What's the deal?
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Neither, it just reminded me of the episode
Posted by: rockjock
Quote:
Originally posted by redwench
oh yes. i play barbie games on my comp. wouldnt dream of playing baldurs gate, d2, starcraft or any other "manly" game.
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I have a couple of old Barbie games you can have. My daughter and I don't play them anymore. Just teasing you Red.
I actually do have a couple if anyone is interested in freebies.
Posted by: one
Yeah NovaZ, a title is the main course for marketing 101. But if you're wondering what's causing all the buzz -- that's not a title.
Any title can only conjure up a mental image of what to expect. The real deal is the visual impact created by the medium.
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