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See! It isn't just the "US" that is getting tired of it all!
(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)
Posted by: EOT(US)
Isreal is fed up too! <---- he said "at war" .... not me!
Posted by: SKYHN
I thought they have been at war now for years...
Posted by: redwench
they more or less have. this really isnt anything new, just an escalation.
Posted by: Chako
Ellen, you cannot make any inference between the two other then to state that those suicide
bombers are Muslim.
Israel isn't a victim in all of this no matter how much American news has portrayed it as being
one.
Personally, I think there will never be peace in the region. We can all thank the United Nations
for causing that fine mess down there when they created Isreal on Palestinian lands. Then we can
thank the US for supporting Israel, giving them one hell of an army, money, etc...so that they can
become a bastion for American interest in the Middle East.
When you look at the whole conflict, who do you think keeps losing the most lives? It isn't Isreal
with their standing armies and their controlling regime. The Palestinian people are at their wits
end and don't have any other way for reprisals other then to blow themselves up. It is sad, but
true. They don't have an army, they don't have a say, they are controlled economically, have little
pride because Israel has even taken that away. They are a third class citizen on their own lands.
Racial hatred has been there for a long time, nor will it go away anytime soon.
So, technically, you can't just say "terrorism" and that is it...you must see why such activities are
happening. There is a reason for all things. There are issues on both sides that need to be
addressed.
I am sure the people of Palestine don't want to kill themselves, however their religion does make
it easy for them to do so. Nor is it the fault of Palestinian either, for Israel and its people have
done more to make it as it is today. Talk about armed patrollers scouring Palestinian
neighbourhoods. Talk about Palestinian working where Israelis want them to work. Talk about
the economic yoke that Israel has imposed upon Palestinians. Talk about the segregation between
the two. If your Palestinian, there are areas your not allowed to go. Talk about Israel and their
reprisal methods where one Palestinian gunman shoots at someone, and tanks roll into an area
and start burning and shooting houses. The list can go on and on.
You may think I am pro Palestine, but I am not. I am an impartial spectator to the whole thing on
my TV. I also understand the regions complexities and history. This is not a new problem. As
Red has stated, it is an old problem, from two people with long memories and racial/religious
hatred. I personally think there will be no peace. I fully see two sides equally to blame. I see two
sides who are not willing to end it for peace. I see two sides coached in hatred.
I must admit though that the current Israeli Government is doing all they can to increase these
"terrorist" activities so that they can get the US fully on their side. So that they can attack the
other side with impunity. I can see it all now..and it makes me sick. Only time will tell....
Nor do I condone terrorism...but I do understand the reasons for what is happening down there. It is tragic in the extreme. For it to stop, both sides will have to bend backwards in compromise...do any of you see that ever happening in our life time?
Posted by: Null Actor
Might I also point out that Isreal is ignoring a UN order demanding that they pull out of occupied territory.
Oh, and I'd just like to ask... if isreal is such a victim in this, how can they justify this:
http://www.msnbc.com/news/732442.asp?cp1=1
Posted by: Null Actor
Oh, and I suppose I should make it clear, I'm not defending palestinian extremists or their tactices.
I'm just pointing out that there is no innocent side in this situation. They are both equally at fault for the happenings.
Posted by: Null Actor
Just a snippet:
 Quote:
Some of the military officers aren’t so nice. So journalists have been forced to learn a surreal kind of military sign language, slowly approaching tanks in an unthreatening way.
Trained on reporters, the turrets are raised up and down to indicate whether passage is allowed. In a more direct approach, troops fire directly at approaching reporters. Our armored car took 15 rounds as we tried to make our way back to our lodgings Monday night.
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Reporters talking about isreally forces.
Posted by: EOT(US)
Chako, I agree with all of the posts above.
They have been fighting forever.
The only point I was inferring to was the statement that Sharon made "It's War". I don't think I have ever heard either side (Israel/Palestine) use those specific words before, and it is SCARY as hell. Because "if" a full scale "war" between Israel AND Palestinian breaks out it will not be just the two of them ... it will be Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, ect. ect. ect. ..... because "all" of the "Middle Eastern" countries have their own allies. In "my" opinion.
That was the only thing that I was talking about. Sorry my one line sentence did not make clear what I was saying.
Posted by: Null Actor
Yeah, I figure there is a 50% chance that this is the start of WW3.
Posted by: redwench
well, since the us is israels biggest supporter, id say that if we used our brains and stayed out of it, then ww3 would be avoided. the israelis really brought this on themselves when they invaded lebanon in the 60s, then refused to return the land. well, the israeli govt did, not the people, i do understand the difference. but really, this conflict is of thier own making (both sides), and they should be left alone to settle it themselves.
Posted by: Arta
Well, i think it should be made quite clear that if the Evil W called Sharon on the phone and said "Stop what you are doing, now. Pull out, now", sharon would do it. Isreal does nothing without american approval, because without america, isreal is a minnow in a pond full of sharks...
But bush won't do that, because condemning isreal for it's actions would invalidate his little crusade against the middle east and utterly destroy what credibility he does have (very little imho).
The US needs to get behind the rest of the world and utterly condemn what Sharon is doing, with no loopholes and no concessions. Until then - I don't see Isreal backing down.
Posted by: Null Actor
Agreed. But, like you said, the US telling them to back down would make them the worlds largest hypocrite.
*shrug*
I fully expected dubya to destroy the world if he got in to office.
Posted by: Kdr Kane
Well, you are just wrong then.
Posted by: Null Actor
If you can still say that by the end of his term, I'll be happy as a pig in shit.
Posted by: AK47
He's not going to destroy the world by himself.
Posted by: Muggs
Funny how most of this "terrorismt" in Israel once was considered Fighting for your rights and your freedom? Funny how that changes to suit the people of today. Its all bullshit and most of the stuff we hear about is propaganda.
Posted by: Shalome
Terrorist is just a word. What's a terrorist to one group is a freedom fighter to another group. It's all semantics, usually. (NOTE: don't jump all over me, I'm not defending ANY senseless acts of violence, anywhere, at any time)
History is written by the winners of wars. These people have been killing each other over the same piece of land for 2000 years. I somehow doubt the power of modern words is going to change ancient sentiment.
"And those with power, they write the histories.. and those who suffer, they write the songs..." - singer/songwriter: Jason Stanton, album: Reconciliation Project, 2001.
Posted by: Ion Silverbolt
War is the only thing that will finally end the Isreal/Palistine feud. I remember all this garbage going on when I was like 5. And it was going on way before that.
War isn't the answer, but when hate and religious zealotry go this far, nothing will sway them to change their minds. The best thing the World can do is stay out of it and let them go at it.
Posted by: Fenix2004
Not even the smartest politicians can figure out a solution to this problem. I say cut the support to the Israelis and try to let them solve it on their own..
Posted by: Null Actor
Cut support to isreal, and they'll be wiped out in a matter of days. They aren't exactly loved in that region.
It's WW2 sympathy that keeps anyone helping them.
Of course, visible support of isreal is what is keeping the situation from turning in to an all out full scale multi-country war.
It's a catch 22.
What I think should happen, is a big BIG UN strike force goes in, and takes away all their weapons, ammo, explosives, and military machinery. On both sides.
If they want to kill each other, let them do it hand to hand. Let them see the faces of those they kill.
Posted by: Chako
I don't think that would work Nova. For one thing, I am sure some would love to go at it hand to
hand.
Besides, why should We...meaning other countries....pay for a force to police the area?
No, the only recourse to peace is to have Israel bend a little, then to have the Palestinians bend a
little..etc...till they hammer out a good deal for everyone.
However, this still won't stop some idiot from strapping 50 pounds of explosives and becoming a
bomb.
There just is no cure for religious insanity....
Posted by: AK47
correct chako.
my idea:
let them fight. we shouldnt be involved at all.
Posted by: Null Actor
Quote:
Originally posted by Chako
I don't think that would work Nova. For one thing, I am sure some would love to go at it hand to
hand.
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I'm sure they would. However, as long as things aren't blowing up, we don't have to hear about it on the news.
Posted by: Null Actor
Actually, now that I think about it, news should just report about the conflict like a sports score.
Have it just scroll across the bottom: Isreal XX kills, Palestine XX kills.
Then at least we'd know who's winning.
Posted by: Ion Silverbolt
Quote:
Originally posted by Nova Z
Actually, now that I think about it, news should just report about the conflict like a sports score.
Have it just scroll across the bottom: Isreal XX kills, Palestine XX kills.
Then at least we'd know who's winning.
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LOL, and Palastinian cheerleaders would have those things covering their faces.
As for Isreal, they could probably wipe out most of the countries around it combined without any outside aid. Isreal is the only country there that isn't wrecked in poverty. Not to mention the only one with a working government.
Posted by: Arta
Yeah but if the surrounding countries declared war, Iraq would join in, and Iraq has sharper teeth than isreal's neighbours...
Posted by: Muggs
The UN should force a cease fire and make them start negotiations. This war has been ongoing forever, todays nations can help and thats to force a non violent solution. If a side uses violence during this process they should be tried for war crimes and forced out of power. The difference now a days is that we should strive for non-violent solutions, not just go in and beat the shit out of each other.
Posted by: TotalRecall
Give them all equal small scale weapons and let them go at it. See who wins, see who's more ignorant...fighting over a piece of land, hah...let them die.
Posted by: Muggs
TotalRecall, you realize that has done before and it hasnt imporved anything? The land they are fighting for just happenes to be considered some of the most holyiest land in the world. Kinda funny how they can do all that killing there though.
Posted by: Shalome
Yeah, it's funny what you can get away with if you're acting under orders from your personal interpretation of a higher power...
Posted by: EOT(US)
Well said Shal!
Posted by: redwench
um........thats just wrong dude.
Posted by: Muggs
it was an example
Posted by: Shalome
*begs god to suspend Muggs' arse from these boards for being a jackass*
Be glad you don't know me in real life, Muggs.
*guts Muggs and offers his internal organs to the gods as a sacrifice to make sure her request is heard*
Posted by: laborat
a truely American solution to the crisis, would be to just buy Jerusalem, dismantle it piece by piece and rebuild it in Las Vegas as a casino theme park. or barring that maybe we should just nuke the region into radioactive slag.
only when the religious sites are beyond the reach of zealots of both sides, will the wars end... for me what is truely sad, is the realization that Israel may not be able to take the next step to maturity as a nation. The one leader of Israel in recent years that could have achieved Peace in the region, was assassinated by an Israeli!!!
You can look between the headlines and see the consequences of Religion dictating Government policy. I thank our Forefathers, for insisting on Separation between Church and State.
Posted by: redwench
as long as we keep supporting israel with money and weaponry, they will never change. theyre like the neighborhood bully that beats up on all the smaller kids.
when the country was first founded after the war, the aid was certainly appropriate. but they arent even self sufficient, and after 50 years, its time they became such.
Posted by: Ion Silverbolt
Quote:
Originally posted by Muggs
it was an example
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It's an example of how to get banned. Respect your fellow forum members please.
Posted by: Null Actor
Quote:
Originally posted by Shalome
*begs god to suspend Muggs' arse from these boards for being a jackass*
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God says: Here is a warning muggs: if it's offensive to someone, it's not humor. This is a warning. Keep it up, you'll have your posting rights suspended.
Posted by: redwench
ah, very kind of you gentlemen to give muggs his weekly warning. he takes every one of them to heart.
Posted by: AK47
Quote:
Originally posted by Nova Z
God says: Here is a warning muggs: if it's offensive to someone, it's not humor. This is a warning. Keep it up, you'll have your posting rights suspended.
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You are god?!
Man, MDK2 was so bad, I could have sworn Satan himself coded it!
Posted by: Gerbilo
ahahahaha!!
hey... i wonder where my copy of that game is... i remember it being cool... the dog guy ruled!! i couldn't be the cyclone chamber thing...
Posted by: Fenix2004
Israel attacked a couple of palestinian towns today. Could this be the start of World War III?
Posted by: Chako
heh?
Only if we let them.
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